Hi-Sci-Fi

Yes. Now that we’ve uncovered this, we will finally abolish religion…I wish.

The thing with believers is that most of these guys (and yes, mostly guys or deluded chicks) that they will find this book “offensive” material as it clashes with their dogma.

Of course there was no resurrection. Nor would there be one. And even if there were a mention of it, we are talking metaphorically here. Not some crazy “we’re going to heaven”. I mean, what kind of a cruel asshole is your god, where all peeps are whisps of ghostly immaterial shape, and you, Jesus, the only child of god, would be all flesh and bone. And not just any bone and flesh, but the kind of ripped, massively destroyed one.

All of this religious stuff is BS. And deep inside, they all know it…except for Charles Manson.

is obviously a story for morons and little children. This is going to be great. Now, it would be more interesting to see some translations and analysis posted on the site as well. We are condemning public to not knowing, and not being able to examine the texts in question. HiSciFi has been outspoken on the subject of availability of scholarly articles in public domain, and as far as I’m concerned, you’re right on the money – we need to open up the flood gates of knowledge banks. Why is Vatican library closed? Preservation of texts for archival purpose or perhaps just hiding what should have been exposed years ago.

I beg you and all your listeners and readers to take action, and demand information. Demand Codex be not just posted, but explained in detail. Demand information from your politicians, for your libraries, from your academics. We need to know everything.

From what I can see, you are wrong. The ressurection is mentioned; one of the ressurection narratives is not.

I think you will find that the final verses of the Gospel of Mark were missing in this Codex Sinaiticus. Big deal. They were also missing from other early manuscripts.

There are many other references to the Ressurection.

Bullshit. And I’m calling it! Irma pointed out that resurrection in Codex Sinaiticus is not mentioned, and that is correct. Article does not refer to “early manuscripts” but Codex Sinaiticus specifically. Resurrection is missing from Codex, but rather explains that Jesus’ body is absent from the tomb. Many believers are prompted by the fact that the body is missing as a sign of resurrection. Prophet, I think you can agree that myself and notably most fans of HiSciFi don’t give a toss about Codex Sinaiticus or other religious dogma. Not sure why you would try to even have this debate when it is so clearly absent of relevant information.

dude are you that dense? there are 4 gospels. Mark is the only gospel that doesn’t mention the ressurection, the other 3 mention the ressurction. In the codex 3 gospels mention the ressurection and the mark doesn’t.

Calm down, everyone. I have been very familiar with the codex for years, and the Resurrection accounts are present. I’m not sure what the news outlets were referring to when they mentioned missing “Resurrection Verses” – possibly the omission of part of Mark 16.

In any case, you can check for yourself. I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad tidings for those of you who would like to see belief in the Galilean Carpenter as God’s Son go away, but the verses are online now for all to see.

For example, the Matthean account of the Resurrection can be found here:

http://www.codexsinaiticus.org/en/manuscript.aspx?book=33&chapter=28&lid=en&side=r&zoomSlider=0

The translation from this page is as follows:

27:64 Command therefore that the tomb be made safe till the third day, lest perhaps the disciples come and steal him and say to the people: He has risen from the dead, and the last deception shall be worse than the first.

65 Pilate said to them: You have a guard: go, make it as safe as you know how.

66 And they went and made the tomb safe, sealing the stone and setting the guard.

28:1 But after the sabbath, as it began to dawn into the first of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the tomb.

2 And lo, there had been a great earthquake; for an angel of the Lord having descended from heaven and come, had rolled away the stone and had sat upon it.

3 And his appearance was like lightning, and his raiment white as snow.

4 And for fear of him the keepers did shake and became as dead men.

5 But the angel answered and said to the women: Fear not you; for I know that you seek Jesus who was crucified;

6 he is not here; for he has risen as he said: Come, see the place where he lay.

7 And go quickly and tell his disciples that he has risen from the dead; and behold, he goes before you into Galilee: there you shall see him. Lo, I have told you.

8 And going away quickly from the sepulcher with fear and great joy, they ran to bring his disciples word.

9 And behold, Jesus met them, saying: Hail. And they came and laid hold of his feet, and worshipped him.

10 Then says Jesus to them: Fear not: go, tell my brethren that they go into Galilee, and there shall they see me.

11 But as they were going, be hold, some of the guard came into the city and told the chief priests all that had been done.

12 And having come together with the elders, and taken counsel, they gave much money to the soldiers,

13 saying: Say that his disciples came by night and stole him while we slept.

14 And if this be heard before the governor, we will persuade him and make you secure.

15 And they took the money and did as they were taught; and this saying is commonly reported among the Jews to this day.

16 But the eleven disciples went into Galilee, to a mountain where Jesus had appointed them;

17 and when they saw him they worshipped, but some doubted.

18 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying : All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.

19 Go, make disciples of all nations, baptizing them into the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

20 teaching them to observe all things whatever I commanded you. And lo, I am with you, all the days, to the conclusion of the age.

~Codex Sinaiticus Translation

Superjade, please review the evidence. Resurrection is mentioned frequently in Codex Sinaiticus, not just that “Jesus’ body is missing”. Please see relevant narratives in Matthew, Luke, John, and the ICor 15:3-6, where Paul asserts that there were over 500 witnesses to the resurrected Jesus.

The full Resurrection account is also told in 3 of the 4 Gospels, while Mark omits any verses past v8. Thus, in this version of Mark they had not yet seen the resurrected Jesus, but were told by an angel that they would see Him in Galilee.

This is hardly as you represented things.

Apparently people are not reading the actual text and are misquoting others. There is in fact mention of the resurrection in the text. Its just excluded from Mark.

http://www.codex-sinaiticus.net/en/manuscript.aspx?dir=next&folioNo=5&lid=en&quireNo=81&side=r&zoomSlider=0

Go to John Chapter 20 Verse 5 or so.

Sorry guys even then it was mentioned, just not by every disciple. But this is still 100 years post Council of Nicaea so there is no way of knowing the authenticity of these writings.

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The notion that the “resurrection” is referenced in the Codex Sinaiticus is not proof that any such event happened. Here are some problems for you apologists:

1. All 4 Gospels were technically written anonymously. The names of the authors were attributed to the writings after the fact.

2. All 4 Gospels were clearly written after Christ’s reported death, and some may have been written decades leter. The problem with this is clear re. the Gospel of John. If the author of John were an associate of Christ, he would have to have been around 90 years old (since the Gospel of John was apparently written around 90AD). That is a neat trick considering the average life expectancy of men in the Roman Empire was typically under 30 years of age.

3. Many scholars now believe Mark was the 1st Gospel written. Too bad it chops off at Mark 16:8. The remaining verses were obviously added by a redactor. It is also amazing how much of Matthew and Luke were apparently copied verbatim from Mark (assuming Mark was written before them). They differ significantly when they get to the resurrection. The miracles tend to grow as you progress from Mark to Matthew and Luke and John.

4. Very little is written about Christ prior to His ministry. Strange that the Son of God lived such an obscure life for some 30 years. There is something written about His birth and His appearance at the Temple at age 12. Aside from that, not much until He started preaching. God works in mysterious ways… to keep His only begotten Son so obscure for nealy all His life.

5. All 4 Gospels (including the interpolated verses of Mark 16:9-20) tell a markedly different resurrection story. Strange that the Holy Spirit would move men to contradict one another on such an important event. I expect precision from God… considering He wrote the 10 Commandments with His own finger…

Christian apologists take the cake. They are so damn certain they are correct that they don’t want to be open to the possibility that data may contradict their beliefs. Good thing the church yielded to science and reason over the years. Otherwise, the earth might still be “flat”, the earth might be the “center of the solar system”, mental illness might be chalked up to “demon possession”, and heretics might still be burned at the stake with green wood as fuel (to make the roasting last longer).

Hooey!

@ Pious_Ted

every “holy”book and every godbased religion goes against evidence and common logic,but evidence is not what people who belief are into…sadly

i on the other hand fear them more then they amuse me…u say the church yielded to science yet in many places u have schools teaching creation instead of evolution and other semi religious things like abstinence only(where they basicly tell teenagers that the only way not to get pregnant or not to get stds is to not have sex,they misinform against condoms and other birthcontrol)

and the more fanatic among them arent shy to use terrorism to push their beliefs(blowing up abortion clinics)

i think if atheists dont stand their ground the western world will take a turn back to the dark ages

like adam often says:its time we start looking at religious people as someone having a mental illness,if i would have an invisible friend that talks to me id be locked up but if this friend happens to be jesus then ur a good person not a lunatic :s

people should be free to believe whatever they want,but when people start making real life choices and take real life actions based on what they think their made up god wants em to do it leads to bad things…

the thing is that there are so many versions of the bible that the believers themselves dont even know which one is the original. That is a problem that will remain with this religion forever. :/

ass. How perfect for a spammer boy.

id also like to add that this find made things only worse. instead of improving the matter.

Strange that the Holy Spirit would move men to contradict one another on such an important event. I expect precision from God… considering He wrote the 10 Commandments with His own finger…

I’m not sure what the news outlets were referring to when they mentioned missing “Resurrection Verses”

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no really. thanks a lot.

Good grief, Ted, if you think pointing out that Codex S. contains Resurrection narratives is “blindly” defending something, methinks you are addicted to your presuppositions. I am well aware that many scholars think Mark was the oldest Gospel and that both Luke and Matthew copied chunks from them as well as the infamous and undiscovered “Q”. But that is rather beside the point of my comment. The rumor was going around that Codex S. was bereft of Resurrection references entirely, and that is the matter I addressed.

As far as further research goes, I eagerly agree with you. Of course I would love to do much more research. Thank you for the encouragement.

In the spirit of reciprocation, I would urge you to enrich your own studies by improving your understanding of “context” and “intent”. The scholarly world will benefit mightily, I’m sure.

Many Bible scholars now consider Mark to be the oldest Gospel recorded. If so, it is clear that the authors of Matthew and Luke copied verbatim significant chunks of text from Mark (or from another common source). Direct copying of large amounts of text really weakens the argument that all the texts were inspired. The Holy Spirit doesn’t need a textual source for copying. Further, the books of Matthew, Luke and John all tell different version of the resurrection. They all differ in the details.

Don’t blindly defend anything. Examine the facts.

I would delete your comment but since you’ve already been named ass, I will leave it be.

isn’t it just? all this inconsistency. maybe God is like Lucas? Refuses to reflect back on what has already been written in order to keep it consistent.

having breakfast w god this morning. it prefers cereal. i prefer coffee.

Find this threat kind of tiresome. The whole point was that the codex differs. If bible WAS written by some kind of infallible, omnipotent power, there WOULD BE NO DISCREPANCY BETWEEN THE VERIONS of this presumably flawless and otherworldy book. so booya.

Timothy O’Fallon,

Methinks you are delusional. Further, I chose to broaden the scope of my exchange. Methinks you should comprehend this.

Enjoy your journey to nowhere.